Sidereal astrology dates

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What is my sidereal sign? - Mastering the Zodiac

For instance, when I was programming my app that uses a Placidus like formulation, the formula given in the reference blows up due to an intermediate calculation of a trig function going out of range. By substituting a mathematically equivalent formula, the effect is avoided. So, there can be a lot of different reasons for different approaches.

In my opinion, most of the differences seem to be due to differing opinions of how it ought to be done. For instance, Placidus, Topocentric and Svarogich are three different mathematical and geometric variants of Placidus. Astrodienst has chosen the latter out of agnosticism. For Topocentric, Polich and Page performed some unfounded mathematical trickery. Svarogich maintained the same formulation as for normal points on the sphere, but points out that there are sometimes three solutions to the formula for mundane positions, and one needs to look at them to decide which makes sense in a given situation.

Hi Ed; I guess one has to be really on top of the game here and given the variation with different house implementations, the question of which house system to use becomes, to some extent, even more complicated. Because I was born and lived half my life in England, Placidus and Koch made no sense, and until I discovered Alcabitus, I relied on equal house charts! As you say, this is very interesting, and thanks to you and Mark for enlightening me further.

And thanks for the additional info on the case you looked at. I actually contributed the font and interpretive texts for this [free] program, which the latter needs to be activated through the settings. Another great show well done Chris. It would have been interesting to have had Ken Bowser on the show for the Western Sidereal perspective an opportunity lost I think? There is no reason one cannot use the Tropical Zodiac within the framework of Jyotish.

We know have the technology to use the real Visual constellations as the backdrop for a more accurate astrology based on the 13 sign constellations. Sidereal AStrology should never be termed as Vedic Astrology. Sidereal Astrology developed in ancient Iraq. Vedic astrology is a wrong concept altogether and Indian astrology is right word. Indian Astrology never used the zodiac but the constellation nakshatras and other concepts.

It is a different astrology altogether like Chinese, Maya, Egyptian and Celtic. Somewhere in 4th Century, some Indian astrologers started using the zodiac. Since, the influence was Greek, I think the first Indian zodiac astrologers were using Tropical. Ancient Indians hardly remembered birthdates. So, zodiac was not at all popular. Even, nakshatra constellation was only a literary work and not put into use. Recently last 50 years , the zodiac has made an impression in India.

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Even, when I was young, astrology meant palm reading. Since, Nakshatra astrology became popular in last 90 years, the sidereal calculation was also applied to zodiac. Many astrologers in India use the word Vedic astrology only to play the emotional game with other Indians. The reason is purely monetary. Regarding Sidereal vs Tropical debate, I am still confused and is still open to interpretations.

Great talk as well. This will be true no matter the hemisphere. Only just found these — so donkey years 2 late to leave a topical comment. These podcasts are really interesting, I am slowly ploughing my way through them. Nice work Chris and Team. Also: Lahiri was not chairman of the CRC, merely its secretary. He also printed a fairly popular ephemeris in India so no vested interests in having his ayanamsa being right. He was by all accounts an astrologer himself.

Zodiac Signs Symbols

There is no historical use of using Chitra Spica as reference star to define degree zero of the Zodiac. The constellations are indeed of unequal size, but where were their original boundaries? Like the boarders of countries, did these not shift over the ages. Perhaps the lower section of Orphiuchus was originally part of Scopius? Modern constellations probably bear little resemblance to the ancient view of the skies.

Perhaps it was just convenient to divide the zodiac into equal12 segments. Precession is not constant — so that puts a whole new slant on nutation calculation, nicely pointed out by Kenneth. Weirdly Hipparcos used Chitra as one of his important starts to measure precession, he placed it at roughly degrees longitude, 3 degrees different to the popular Lahiri ayanamsa. There are many Ayanamsa used in India. The range Kenneth gives is very conservative. Some are much larger ie: more than 3 degrees different. Prior to Lahiri the most popular ayanamsa in India was Revatipaksha.

Its a big mystery why we called Chitrapaksha, the Lahiri Ayanamsa. Do you have a citation or a reference I could follow up on for the statement about a Greek prior to Hipparchus discovering precession? Never heard of a Greek source for precession before Hipparchus. And I have read very widely on this topic. However, there has always been a dissenting view that the Babylonians first discovered precession. However, the idea has been out of favour with academics for a long time.

In particular Otto Neugebauer was the most prominent researcher who sought to refute the theory of a Babylonian discovery of precession.

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Thank you for the link Mark, I will read. That being said its quite amazing to think that data from Timocharis was accurate enough to make his Hipparchus latter comparative observation and to then formulate the idea that earths orbit was not stable. While I note precession is commonly referred to as a wobble, I see it more in terms of orbits sliding backward over time. Hi Chris, quick reply. Sorry if my previous comments came over sounding pedantic, I was meaning to re-write and tone down.

I get flappy about ayanamsa as I spent quite a bit of time trying to get to the bottom of that particular issue. There is a section on Hipparchus. Does that help? I assumed the author to be reasonable, it seemed well researched. BTW — these are excellent podcasts, really professional. Thank you so much for this wonderful discussion.

The Validity of the Sidereal Zodiac

I have been thinking about this a great deal lately and stumbled over this episode by accident. So happy I did! This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed. The Astrology Podcast is a weekly show featuring discussions on technical, historical, and philosophical topics related to astrology, hosted by professional astrologer Chris Brennan. Patrons can get early access to new episodes, higher quality recordings, a private discussion forum, and more.

Patreon supporters can also get access to a private monthly podcast where we talk about the most auspicious electional charts over the next few weeks:. You can subscribe to the podcast for free via email, iTunes, or other mobile apps. See our subscription page for more information on how to subscribe.

Outline of the Episode Here is an outline of some of the main points that we focused on during the course of this episode, based on the show notes that were prepared before we talked: There are three zodiacs: constellational, sidereal, and tropical.

Started with the constellations along the ecliptic. Ecliptic is the path the planets take across the sky. Only goes through certain constellations By the 5th century BCE the zodiacal signs were standardized in Mesopotamia. Sidereal zodiac with 12 signs of 30 degrees each. Later by the 2nd century we see Ptolemy firmly adopt the tropical zodiac. Based on the solstices and the equinoxes. More connected with the seasons.

In this period the zodiacs were roughly aligned, so there was no issue. Due to precession they move about 1 degree every 72 years. Minor change in a lifetime, but adds up over centuries.

Everything You Need To Know About Sidereal Astrology

Subtract about 24 degrees from a tropical position to get sidereal position. A planet at 14 Aries in tropical is around 20 Pisces in sidereal. Who uses tropical now? Tropical is primarily used by western astrologers since the middle ages. All Sun-sign columns use the tropical zodiac. Who uses sidereal? Sidereal mainly used by Indian astrologers. In the 20th century some western astrologers started using sidereal. Brings us today where there is a debate between astrologers about which is best to use.

This is a genuine technical debate that has decent pros and cons on both sides. It is complicated by the long traditions behind each, and the tendency for astrologers to identify with their chart placements. Separate issue is the use of precession as an attack vector by skeptics. Astrologers have to settle this as a technical, conceptual, and practical issue. Some questions to ask: Do tropical and sidereal astrologers use the zodiac in the same way?

Do they attribute the same qualities to the signs? Is it the case that one approach is valid and the other is not valid? Or is it possible that both are valid in some way? Attempts to answer the question from a historical perspective: One potential way of answering this is figuring out what zodiac the ancients originally intended to use.

Understanding Sidereal Astrology

The problem in the Hellenistic tradition is that they seem to have drawn on both tropical and sidereal considerations. In , Walter Berg introduced his sign zodiac, which has the additional sign of Ophiuchus. For the purpose of determining the constellations in contact with the ecliptic, the constellation boundaries as defined by the International Astronomical Union in are used. For example, the Sun enters the IAU boundary of Aries on April 19 at the lower right corner, a position that is still rather closer to the "body" of Pisces than of Aries.

The IAU defined the constellation boundaries without consideration of astrological purposes. The dates the Sun passes through the 13 astronomical constellations of the ecliptic are listed below, accurate to the year The dates will progress by an increment of one day every The corresponding tropical and sidereal dates are given as well. From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. This article has multiple issues. Please help improve it or discuss these issues on the talk page.

Learn how and when to remove these template messages. This article may require cleanup to meet Wikipedia's quality standards. The specific problem is: Article needs to distinguish clearly between different types of sidereal astrology. See talk page Please help improve this article if you can. July Learn how and when to remove this template message. This article needs additional citations for verification. Please help improve this article by adding citations to reliable sources.

Sidereal and tropical astrology

Unsourced material may be challenged and removed. Main article: Ayanamsa. All of the assertions about a contemporary starting date ignore the fact that the Sun has been rising in the Western Fish of Pisces for many centuries. Fagan explains the origins of the exaltation degrees, modes of time reckoning and the importance of the stars on the ascendant. He also discusses the importance of transits to the lunar return and to the progressed chart.

Fagan displayed his keen understanding of the intrinsic natures of the planets in his descriptions of transits to the natal Moon. He considered these transits to be especially potent when the Moon is emphasized in the foreground of the lunar return. Read More.

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